[TheList] Squawking Tones on Police Channel & High Frequency Tone on Channel

Mon Mar 21 09:28:29 AEDT 2022

Ok well that's understandable.
How do CP units communicate directly with police in the P25 areas? I know
in the analog regions they have a standard radio on the local police
repeater channel.

On Mon, 21 Mar 2022, 11:08 Darryl Healy, <darryl0768healy at gmail.com> wrote:

> They are encrypted due to a couple of issues with, you guessed it, scanner
> users who got too close for comfort and due to sensitive information being
> TX.
>
> I'm a part of another CP and we still use ESA.
>
> As for any CP having access to P25, NO WAY! That's a highly classified
> radio only limited to police, atleast for CP.
>
> On Mon, 21 Mar 2022, 10:35 Radio Engineering, <
> radio.restorations at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Community patrol are encrypted? What the heck for? They do a good job,
>> but their coms is mostly run of the mill stuff - nothing that requires
>> secrecy.
>> I presume they have a handheld P25 radio to communicate with police as
>> well?
>>
>> On Sun, 20 Mar 2022, 21:27 Darryl Healy, <darryl0768healy at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I assume corrections DMR will obviously be encrypted also?
>>>
>>> For those that don't know Chch INTL aviation security are on the Orion
>>> CON+ network and it works well for them having regional wide coverage and a
>>> repeater setup at the airport itself.
>>>
>>> Also all of chch intl is on this network including airport crash fire
>>> which aren't encrypted along with all the airline, servicing and cleaning
>>> comms.
>>>
>>> There is alot of interesting stuff on the Orion network including
>>> community patrol which have just gone encrypted.
>>>
>>> The network caters for hundreds of companies from florists, couriers,
>>> truck companies to alot of council work and then some...
>>>
>>> On Sun, 20 Mar 2022, 14:18 DogSec - Richard, <richard at dogsecurity.co.nz>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hard to say...  but most likely that will be the case, yes you'll no
>>>> longer hear police.
>>>>
>>>> The Government is bringing in NGCC (Next Gen Critical Communications)
>>>> network which will be P25, Cellular and IP based telecommunications setup,
>>>> similar to Australia, America, etc.  The ESA/UHF analog networks will be
>>>> shut off.
>>>> It will have Police, FENZ, St John, WFA, and possibly CivDef etc.  It's
>>>> possible that some or all of it will be encrypted, that will be up to each
>>>> orgainization.  I'd imagine that it will follow along with the current
>>>> Auckland, Wellington, Wairarapa and Canterbury setups where Police are
>>>> encrypted.  But that could change as happened in Victoria on the MMR/RMR
>>>> networks (basically speaking MMR is UHF, RMR is VHF)  where Ambulance were
>>>> unencryped, but that's changed and is now encrypted..  Encryption is done
>>>> on the subscriber unit - P25 supports encryption.
>>>>
>>>> The current P25 network I understand to be owned by the Police, this
>>>> new network will not be.  I would assume that the Police will sell their
>>>> equipment so they no longer have to worry about the repeater networks
>>>> falling over, that would become the NGCCs problem, but they would keep
>>>> their current radio techs as they still need people on the ground looking
>>>> after vehicles/handhelds... I will also assume that NGCC won't have any
>>>> interest in dealing with subscriber units as it's a lot to manage - they'll
>>>> have enough on their plates to deal with, running a national trunking
>>>> repeater network. I also assume that Police will want to keep their
>>>> codeplugs close to their chest.  FENZ/Police have their own radio techs, so
>>>> it'd be business as usual for them, except no more repeater work - they're
>>>> multi talented in that they do radio, telephony and IT stuff.  St John use
>>>> Vital for repeaters, but contract Tait to subcontract radios, each Civil
>>>> Defence area seems to do their own thing for radio work.  I don't know much
>>>> about WFA other than they use a couple of talkgroups on the Wellington P25
>>>> network.  Others that could join would be government departments...
>>>> Aviation Security, MBIE (Immigration etc)   I will assume that Corrections
>>>> will remain as they are with their current LTR setups that are moving over
>>>> to DMR as they really need prison specific coverage, and keep the prisoner
>>>> transport vehicles on Vital.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 20/03/2022 1:24 pm, Tim Devaney wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Are we not going to be able to receive the police soon ??
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Mar 20, 2022, 12:09 DogSec - Richard <richard at dogsecurity.co.nz>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi BJ,
>>>>>
>>>>> Years ago someone did a write-up about it on here, but basically it's
>>>>> a form of SCADA for monitoring sites remotely.  Some sites are often not
>>>>> easy to get to and may have access issues such as being helicopter access
>>>>> only.  These sites have quite large battery banks, as mains power may be
>>>>> flaky.  The SCADA allows for inputs and outputs to be monitored remotely.
>>>>> They are often polled at specific times, which is why sometimes you may
>>>>> hear the tones underneath voice comms.  If the controller polls and doesn't
>>>>> get a response back then it will retry X amount of times (if programmed)
>>>>> then assumes the site is dead, and alerts get generated.  A variety of
>>>>> things can be monitored. Often these are only 'analog' inputs so you only
>>>>> get very specific details..  You could see things like
>>>>>
>>>>> Battery Bank A is 100/75/50/25% (maybe not even in that much detail)
>>>>>
>>>>> Generator On/Off
>>>>>
>>>>> Entry Door OPEN/CLOSED
>>>>>
>>>>> Alarm ACTIVATED/DEACTIVATED/IN ALARM
>>>>>
>>>>> SOLAR ON/OFF (IE is there voltage coming into the system on the Solar
>>>>> lines)
>>>>>
>>>>> REPEATER POWER ON/OFF  (some repeaters can have an output that's
>>>>> activated when it's in a certain state)  As Daryl mentioned, it would be a
>>>>> (probably unreliable) way of determining if a repeater is working or not.
>>>>>
>>>>> With the NGCC being implemented, a lot of this will eventually become
>>>>> redundant as most things like SCADA would be converted to IP based, and
>>>>> digital radio is also IP based, meaning a lot of this could be sent over a
>>>>> text message over the radio network.  I assume P25, but DMR will prioritize
>>>>> voice over messaging.
>>>>>
>>>>> As for the screeching, lots of factors could be causing that.  I-band
>>>>> links shouldn't really be used for monitoring as they're only
>>>>> point-to-point or point-to-multipoint links meaning you really need to be
>>>>> in line of the path for it to be received. I'd recommend use the VHF/UHF
>>>>> frequencies.  Once again, with things turning to digital soon, they'll
>>>>> probably be redundant with the links will be done over IP.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>> Richard
>>>>> On 20/03/2022 11:23 am, Darryl Healy wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Those tones are something to do with the linking with all the VTGs.
>>>>>
>>>>> They happen every 4 hours at midnight and so on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Someone will no doubt give a more technical explanation of them soon.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 20 Mar 2022, 11:01 BJ, <bjcuizon151 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Was in Dunedin recently and tuned in to police comms. Anyone know
>>>>>> what those squawking tones on some police channels are? It doesn't sound
>>>>>> like fire selcall but more like a really short (~1 sec) burst of what sort
>>>>>> of sounds like a part of the old dial-up handshake.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, was listening to firecom and ambo thru the I-band link in Chch
>>>>>> and on some link channels there is a really high pitched tone that is
>>>>>> present when someone keys up. It can only be heard on a radio with no audio
>>>>>> filtering/DSP as my Tait seems to cancel it out. Does anyone have an idea
>>>>>> what this is as well?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>>>> BJ
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> TheList mailing list
>>>>>> TheList at radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>>> http://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> TheList mailing listTheList at radiowiki.org.nzhttp://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> TheList mailing list
>>>>> TheList at radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>> http://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> TheList mailing listTheList at radiowiki.org.nzhttp://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> TheList mailing list
>>>> TheList at radiowiki.org.nz
>>>> http://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> TheList mailing list
>>> TheList at radiowiki.org.nz
>>> http://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> TheList mailing list
>> TheList at radiowiki.org.nz
>> http://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>>
> _______________________________________________
> TheList mailing list
> TheList at radiowiki.org.nz
> http://radiowiki.org.nz/mailman/listinfo/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://radiowiki.org.nz/pipermail/thelist_radiowiki.org.nz/attachments/20220321/fe72fdfa/attachment-0001.html>